Glen H wrote:
Great, now I have to quit building Gipson Lep Sauls
And GS's too. 
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| We've been warned http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10123&t=52054 |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | We've been warned |
https://www.musicradar.com/news/gibson-issues-threat-to-rival-guitar-builders-you-have-been-warned-were-here-to-protect-our-iconic-legacy |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
In my case, they can't get blood from a turnip. But I'm not building a lot of deliberate copies these days. They'd make more money licensing their legacy instead of spending money on lawyers. |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Gibson can go drink paddy water.... We were discussing this this morning in the shop with clients who brought it up. What poor form to let this out there and the manager who released this press release should be fired. Instead Gibson's message should be positive with spin that their designs are so very successful and iconic with some of the most popular artists and music of all time using their instruments that the whole world wants to be posers... and copy their design. It's not easy being the the industry leader! But no Gibson wants to put a bad taste in everyone's mouth and position themselves as a producer of...... litigation.... not quality, iconic instruments. I was hoping for better after that anal wart Henry was excised but looks like same crap different day. |
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| Author: | Conor_Searl [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
One of my guitar students adores Gibson, and keeps sending me instagram photos of what seem like the same '59 bursts. Something about their new direction just irks me, I'm glad they're getting back to basics, and what originally made them great, but there seems to be a hubris in how they present it. Gibson like Fender is already way ahead of the pack because of all the history that's passed with their name on the headstock, they just barely need to hit the bar and they'll sell millions of guitars. Staking their claim with an iron fist is just poor taste, and smacks of greed, not any kind of noble nod to protecting their heritage. And really Gibson should be shouldering most of the blame for any shrinking of their market share. They've probably driven more business away than any legitimate competing guitar manufacturer has attracted using their ideas. If people aren't trying to pass the guitars they make off as genuine Gibsons, let it lie. The deeper I get into luthiery the less interested I am in "mojo" and as much as I love the 50s/60s designs I'm way more interested in all of the cool new things going on. |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Hesh wrote: I was hoping for better after that anal wart Henry was excised but looks like same crap different day. They are still a Corporation beholden to a board of directors and shareholders more than a musical instrument maker..... So nothing has really changed. I am however incredibly disappointed in Mark. I gave him credit for not being part of that type of BS, but something must have happened. I have some of the funny T-shirts he used to make and sell on instagram like "Keith Richards is my spirit animal". I wonder if old Mark paid royalties to Keith and all those other stars whose images he used for his own profit? I bet not! But he will now be the face of trademark enforcement for big G? That gentleman is corporate hypocrisy at it's finest. Makes me wonder a bit about Norman's too........ |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
For those who missed Mark's video that started this.... https://www.reddit.com/link/c1p9kc/vide ... 431/player |
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| Author: | Glen H [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Great, now I have to quit building Gipson Lep Sauls |
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| Author: | Freeman [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Attachment: IMG_3879.JPG
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| Author: | Hesh [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Glen H wrote: Great, now I have to quit building Gipson Lep Sauls And GS's too.
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| Author: | Hesh [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
We frequently share with our clients that the name "Cordoba" means bridge reglue in Spanish. If making true to form copies of Gibson's designs why not just name your brand "Head Stock Break?" |
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| Author: | Conor_Searl [ Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
I don't understand the logic behind threatening litigation, especially since it doesn't seem to be standard practice for many of Gibson's peers. I've heard Paul Reed Smith can be aggressive this way, but I've never heard similar stories about Fender or Martin who I think could probably make much stronger cases than Gibson. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
I guess Gibson tried to sue Paul Reed Smith years ago with this "all single cuts are our design" crap... Didn't fly. |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Chris Pile wrote: I guess Gibson tried to sue Paul Reed Smith years ago with this "all single cuts are our design" crap... Didn't fly. Exactly!! They lost a case against PRS over the LP body shape.... so this was likely BS to begin with! A publicity stunt??? |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
OTOH we see Les Paul "lawsuit" guitars from time to time, maybe every couple of months. People bid on them on-line and if they win they sometimes bring them to us. We suggest to our clients that every new to them... guitar should be brought to us for at the very least a good triage on the spot with no waiting so if there is an acceptance period they have return rights and reasons why. Anyway of the lawsuit Les Pauls that I've seen nearly all of them have been superior to Gibson Les Pauls in nearly all respects (excluding the 58's through 60's of course). Maybe this is what Gibson fears the most not that someone else is encroaching on their designs but that someone else has a mastery of the designs beyond the current iteration of the Gibson company with their own designs. And I'll belabor this point and that is if my company was just recovering from bankruptcy with new leadership AND the company was known to be an industry bully producing poor quality products job one to me would be up the quality and get known to be a company that's client centric which includes supporting dealers as well as the industry in general. Oh well time to go back to spelling Gibson G*bson. PS: Going to put ThroBaks in my Les Paul and SG further underscoring that G*bson still can't make a pup anywhere close to what they once produced in the original PAFs. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
I guess they were serious - this bit of news hit my inbox this morning.... Gibson is suing Dean for copyright infringement. Part of the suit is over 3 on a side peghead shapes..... Dean's not close to Gibson. I think Fender should sue Gibson over 6 on a side pegheads as used on Firebirds, Trini Lopez, etc. https://guitar.com/news/industry-news/g ... ringement/ |
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| Author: | Conor_Searl [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Or maybe Martin should sue them for making flat top acoustics... |
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| Author: | truckjohn [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Guys, Remember that thousands of fake Gibsons come in from China annually... It's bad enough that Gibson and Martin fakes show up for sale in places like GC... You have to be an expert now if you want to buy a Martin/Gibson/Fender on CL anymore because there are so many fakes coming in.... Shoot - there are multiple websites and YouTube videos describing how to do it..... I believe this is a shot across the bow at that... So for example - pursue litigation against people illegally importing them rather than simply confiscating the illegal imports when they show up... This is sort of an issue like Napster was... Nobody cares about music sharing till THEY personally don't get paid.... It was OK for the big studios to get the shaft - everybody hates them.... But when a local artist can't sell his CD's because everybody downloads them for free - then he pays attention and steps into the fray..... |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Yep, suing Dean for shapes they have been using since 1977..... I say it's a publicity stunt!! Whole thing just reeks of trying to become relevant again.... https://guitar.com/news/industry-news/gibson-sues-dean-guitars-trademark-infringement/?utm_source=hootsuite&utm_medium&utm_term&utm_content&utm_campaign&fbclid=IwAR1s_58EjZfq79hTOH4OA0KidhxWWOsr0yvSl5QFkYqAuUUC-B0ROXRvvMQ |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Purchased a gorgeous fake Les Paul once, got my money back. Have had several fakes on my bench.... Fenders, Martins, copies of Asian stuff.... Right now I have a fake Ibanez Joe Satriani in for setup. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
And now Dean has announced they are fighting back, and have urged other companies to join their efforts. I think Gibson might have bitten off more than they can chew. https://guitar.com/news/industry-news/g ... -responds/ |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Be careful folks and don't say or write the word "guitar" G*bson thinks that they own the word. Did I ever tell you all the story of why Elderly Instruments doesn't sell G*bsons? Never mind I don't want to get sued by G*bson. |
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| Author: | Tim Mullin [ Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Conor_Searl wrote: Or maybe Martin should sue them for making flat top acoustics... With an “X” brace! Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Chris Pile wrote: Have had several fakes on my bench.... Fenders, Martins, copies of Asian stuff.... Right now I have a fake Ibanez Joe Satriani in for setup. I do not even like having them in my shop. I only take them in if I am really slow, otherwise I don't want them in here. Calls into question my work as a restorer having fraudulent copies in my workflow. |
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| Author: | fumblefinger [ Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Attachment: Authentic!.jpg
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| Author: | Hesh [ Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: We've been warned |
Some of the so-called lawsuit guitars of the past from the 80's and 90's were so well made that they were superior to G*bsons in fit and finish, fret plane shapes and the pups did not sound lifeless like the G*bson pups of that era and the current ones do and did. That's why G*bson was originally concerned about fakes some of them underscored that genuine G*bson products were ****. We have had several of these that are owned by locals in our shop for work and they are indeed well made. You see them on Reverb too at times and they bring top dollar often equivalent to G*bsons and nothing is being hidden, they don't say G*bson and are often marketed under their own trade names. The only thing that is G*bsonesque is the shape and dimensions. To be any more authentic they would have to add a dozen defects per copy. I've never seen the need to deny service to people who own these "lawsuit guitars" in as much as they are not labeled or portrayed as G*bsons and it's not my job to police G*bson's idea of what their IP actually is. What I am much more concerned about and with good reason in so much as local laws do require vigilance and subsequent action on my part is spotting stollen property. It's also something that I would want to do for the owners who lost their guitars. I have zero inclination to assist G*bson in continuing to be a manufacturer of substandard quality instruments who favors to litigate over learning to make a decent guitar.... I have to admit that for a New York minute after the bankruptcy and reorg I imagined that the new G*bson might try to return to their past when they produced higher quality instruments. Sadly now seeing the emphasis on being litigious makes me sorry I purchased two of their guitars last year. Perhaps it's time to flip these into a Collings I35. |
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